Now, at this point in the day, I've been spurned enough to remember that today is April 1st and what that day connotes. Sorry, didn't work on me. ;)

WOO HOO!

About damn time someone forced me to re write my whole web site. I really have nothing else to do than update a couple of hundred pages on a vanity site.

I would complain more but I have no life and live at my computer...

I hope tabbed-browsing is an April Fool joke too.

I guess owners of the iLamp will be annoyed. I don't really need table support, I have a laptop...

<blink>blink</blink>

What's the date today?

:)

ROTFL!

go for it dave, we got your back! ;)

David doesn't mention it, but Geraldo Rivera has reported that the latest Super-Secret Hypothetical Build (v69) also replaces any instance of "spacer.gif" with an image from the original hamsterdance.com. The debug menu allows users to choose a picture of the late, great Anne Ramsey instead.

Hmm. The way I heard it, the Ultra-Hypothetical build v66.? was supposed to replace any usage of innerHTML() in JavaScript with redirects to either goatse.cx or tubgirl.com, chosen randomly via a process which takes ten minutes to run and chews up 100% of your CPU while doing so

but what will happen to the three people that use safari ? i guess ebay wont work anymore

Arrg! Now the Tables are turned!!!!!
I guess the aliens really will eat the hard drive......

Well geeze, I was wondering if Dave was ever going to post something today :P

Humor aside, a balanced approach is usually, of course, best. is still 100% valid XHTML Strict markup, as long as it's not nested, and as long as it's used with TABULAR data. For tables of data, it's still the thing to use, it's just layout which is a bad use of tables.

WASP would kick your butt for removing support ;)

that one takes second place only to insidemacgames.com's report of half-life coming to the mac. however, dropping table support would mean that i'd no longer have to worry about tables with the "frame" attribute not displaying properly ;).

Hmmm...will this also destroy dining room tables? Kitchen Tables? Oh, Dave be careful! You could erase The table of Elements. Goodbye, Uranium, we hardly knew ya :-)

Hey, tell Jim there it's "XForms" not "XFORMS". :-)

I thought April Fools jokes were supposed to be believable?

I think we should all support Dave's efforts here by making sure he knows, in excruciating detail, why we each think that only stupid people disagree with our opinion on the proper behavior of CMD-Shift-3 in a tabbed browsing environment.

I'll start.

"Well, duh! It's like, obvious. 'nuff said?"

As a matter of fact, this finally proves a secret plot according to which the rendering engine of safari will be secretly replaced by LaTeX. This was also the true reason why seeding was terminated and AA was always on.

(You cannot turn AA off when viewing the PDF that results on a LaTeX run.)

To gain a decent rendering speed, all requested documents are sent to clusters of XServes wirelessly connected through the new iPod II with AirPort eXtreme. returning the rendered Page as PDF.

Sadly you ommitted that from your article ;-)

iSee

YEAH thanks god.. you finally made it and dropped tables... hope u go on and spare out other useless junk similar to that ;) cheers ralf

LOL, ROTFL!

Good one, I laughed my ass off! :-)))

I'm not sure which is the April Fool's joke here...the table support or the fact that Hyatt said "The next release of Safari..."

I'm beginning to think another release is NEVER going to come.

An amusing piece. It didn't actually stipulate "layout tables" so this would have been vicious in the extreme!

I think we need to petition W3 for two new attributes for the table tag:

honest

(... honestly this really is being used for data)

and

please

(... oh, go on, please - I can't work CSS out)

If the table doesn't have either of these, it's toast. :-)

Next release: no kidding! That last release was like, what, a month ago? That's ages!! Let's get Safari on a more standard update cylce like all the iApps or maybe even the OS... no beta releases and a new version every 6-12 months.

I thought this was fun no matter how obvious it was :)

Well, at least you get x-browser consistency with tables...

UNLIKE CSS POSITIONED ELEMENTS

Is it just the way my browser sees it, or was this announcement made at 3:04pm on 1st April - in other words it was posted *after 12pm*, thus making David Hyatt the April fool :)

Huh? Why would that matter? It was posted on April 1.

At least in the UK, April fools are only allowed to fool up till mid day.

I have a REAL complaint here. Sometimes Safari v60 gets into a state where it will NOT find any text. I've even found the word on the page, SELECTED the word, and typed Cmd-F to open the dialog. Type in THAT WORD, and hit Find, and it tells me it can't find it!!!!! It's Right in front of me!!! I can see it!

What is up with this??

Also how can I search the weblog and/or comments? surely that is available somehow.

I don't know how to get this information to the right people.
Safari has a real problem with Proxy servers. At least in my School district. V48 worked like a champ. v60 just dies. It never goes any where it just sits there. IE woks like a champ and yes like I said v48. Looking for any suggestions about how to get this to the right people. I have submitted a bug.

Really love the browser.

Ok, here's another Safari bug:

http://www.radiolinja.ee/index2.asp

If you navigate to the Erakliendile -> Teenused dropdown menu, the animated gif pops above the other elements with the next animation cycle.

Btw, Safari should really have a public Bugzilla where people could post reports and follow their progress.

-QUOTE--------------
Well, at least you get x-browser consistency with tables...

UNLIKE CSS POSITIONED ELEMENTS
Posted by Dr Robert at April 2, 2003 02:13 PM
--------------------
That's the point, partially. Web pages are meant to be documents of data, brutally honest. The goal of xHTML/CSS and the www is to make these documents accessible to any device, any person, any machine, any time, anywhere, etc.

People used to be taught that you had to work until you got your page "looking exactly the same in all browsers". That's a myth. The web isn't about a consistant look, it's about consistant access. A greyscale PDA can't view a complex table layout with animated background images. But my desktop can. xHTML is about making the accessible document, CSS is about making that document look best for each platform.

Don't think I'm totally against you, CSS positioning can leave a lot to be desired.

>> Huh? Why would that matter? It was posted on April 1.

April fools jokes only apply until 12pm, anything done after that makes the culprit the April fool.

cgriego says:

People used to be taught that you had to work until you got your page "looking exactly the same in all browsers". That's a myth. The web isn't about a consistant look, it's about consistant access.

Dr Robert replies:

This might be OK if the www consisted of blogs and document collections, but what about sites that need/want more graphic design? It's not that CSS is bad as such (it's a GREAT idea), it's the time required to make it work on more than ONE browser. It's all very well for the standards bodies to promote CSS to web designers - they need to instruct millions of people to upgrade their browser as well.

CSS is fine for typographic styling of course.

I can't believe an April Fool's day joke is turning into this discussion, and I can't believe I'm joining in. Anyhow, CSS can give pixel-precise layouts in browsers that properly support it, including most modern browsers. It won't unless you know what you're doing and the capabilities of different browsers, but that was true of tables as well. Granted, it's only over the course of the last year or so that this has come to be true, but nonetheless, CSS does work now and can work for you. The great thing about CSS is that it can do things that table-based layout could never even dream of. The only trick to using it is to finally give up the Netscape 4 ghost.

CSS was "a great idea" back in 2000. Now it's a practical reality for everything from blogs to commercial, high-traffic sites.

I think Dave missed an April 1 opportunity for something like this:

Apple announces nightly builds of Safari - Apple Computer today announced that it will be providing nightly builds of it's upcoming web browser, Safari. "This is in keeping with our long-standing desire to let our customers watch our works-in-progress" said iCEO Steve Jobs. "We tried a seeding program earlier with Safari, but we just weren't getting wide enough distribution." Under the new scheme, the most recent beta build of Safari will be available for public download, and also through the Software Update mechanism. ADC Partners will have full "cvs" access to enable them to incorporate their own patches into the source code. Jobs indicated the distribution plan was suggested by new Apple board member Al Gore, who was the inventor of much of the Safari code.

David - if Dave did actually try that, he'd be lynched.

For immediate release: Apple and Microsoft Announce iExplore for Mac OS X

Building on a long tradition of partnering in internet software, Apple and Microsoft today announced plans to jointly develop a new, flagship web browser application for the Macintosh operating system. Dubbed iExplore, this "powerful and friendly" utility will be built from the existing Microsoft Internet Explorer for Mac code base, but differentiated from its predecessor by a signature Apple brushed-metal appearance.

"We found that, no matter how many hours we poured into making Safari a fast and standards-compliant browser, we just could not get around the fact that 95% of the world uses [Internet Explorer] and the overwhelming majority of web developers target that browser with their code -- including all the long-standing bugs," lamented David Hyatt of Apple's Safari development team. "With iExplore, we don't even have to get Safari to version 1.0. We just rebrand IE and stick it back in the dock. And I get a nice, long vacation."

Apple ignited the personal computer revolution in the 1970s with the Apple II and reinvented the personal computer in the 1980s with the Macintosh. Apple is committed to bringing the best personal computing experience to students, educators, creative professionals and consumers around the world through its innovative hardware, software and Internet offerings.

Microsoft is big enough to let Apple get away with saying that.

April Fool's Day in most of the US is an all-day affair. At any rate, got me to smile.

"The only trick to using it [CSS] is to finally give up the Netscape 4 ghost."

Luckily for those of us who use CSS, there's barely anything left to give up. The number of remaining Netscape 4 users is truly infinitesimal. (Big surprise - it hasn't been updated in a year and a half. It hasn't been significantly updated in three years. Anybody independent-minded enough to switch to it from IE has long since realized how dead it is.) Look at the browser stats on any real, running site and you'll see that coding for Netscape 4 makes about as much sense as coding for Lynx.

mkincaid: "coding for Netscape 4 makes about as much sense as coding for Lynx."

Excuse me, but I *always* code for Lynx. Lynx is my primary browser -- I am using it right now to post this message.
I even set Lynx up as my default browser on OS X.

Sure I love Safari, but Safari will never, ever, ever, replace Lynx. It can't, and it shouldn't, although I certainly would love to see some of Lynx's advanced features get incorporated into Safari.

Lynx is stable. Lynx forces all text to wrap to my window's width. Lynx shows me what software is used by the remote Web server. Lynx does not automatically follow meta refreshes, so I can use AltaVista without having the rug being pulled out from under me. Lynx is faster than Safari, because it doesn't load graphics and ignores font specs. Lynx doesn't support JavaScript, which is how I like it.

-Walter

Oh, and in case anyone's curious, here's what Lynx tells me about the mozillazine server:

Server: Apache/1.3.27 (Unix) mod_gzip/1.3.19.1a mod_throttle/3.1.2 PHP/4.2.3 mod_ssl/2.8.11 OpenSSL/0.9.6g

-Walter

Thank goddess. Nobody uses tables for their intended purpose. Call me an (April) Fool, but I actually support this idea.

Safari is a neat little browser.. it's helped me fix quite a few bugs in my own web programming. A major bug that it helped me fix was forgetting a # when identifying an image map.. now all my image maps work beautifully and I can continue testing in Safari. If only all browsers didn't tolerate the junk that some people write! Then the web would be wonderful and all would be good.

Now, my next gripe is about these liquified chicken strips...

what about chairs???

Hehe I wonder how many people made April Fools jokes about Safari, I did.........

Dave-

A friend just asked me for help with a CSS table problem. It seems Safari doesn't obey the td padding-bottom attribute when set to 0.

http://www.mikejorgensen.com/test/

Has this already been fixed in the latest internal build?

Sorry, disregard my previous comment. It seems it was my incorrect usage of img as a block level element. Adding img { display: block } fixed the problem.

Gratitude is merely the secret hope of further favors.