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October 2, 2007
Mac Firefox UI Disaster, v2.0
If I wanted to use Safari, I'd use Safari. Someone needs to smack whoever keeps screwing with the mac themes and just go back to Pinstripe. They clearly don't have a clue.
Posted by kerz at October 2, 2007 10:58 AM
Comments
Thanks for your insightful, constructive comments.
Posted by: Justin Dolske at October 2, 2007 12:14 PM
Not a problem!
Posted by: Jason at October 2, 2007 12:39 PM
I agree. The upside down Safari-like tabs are crap.
Posted by: Sebhelyesfarku at October 2, 2007 1:06 PM
Ah, the glory being that Pinstripe will likely still exist, should you choose to install it.
I go back and forth on this myself, but all data indicates that our biggest barrier on OSX is that we stick out like a sore-non-OSX-app thumb. People want to use Firefox, and many people preferred the Pinstripe 2.0 theme which moved the browser to a more Safari-like look and feel.
The current mockups are also a little too Safari-ish for my taste, and the guys have gotten that feedback.
Posted by: beltzner at October 2, 2007 1:16 PM
I like some of the newer theme ideas for OS X. The current theme really looks ugly on the Mac though and something needs to be done. I generally disagree that any of those look as much like Safari as some people think they do, but perhaps my eye is more discerning than some.
I like the Safari-style tabs that hang down from above though, but it's certainly not a big deal for me either way.
Posted by: Eric Shepherd at October 2, 2007 2:21 PM
Something that I appreciate about safari style tabs is that they create a more seamless chrome, none of this disjoint, pretend the tabs are attached to the page nonsense.
The upside down tab, provides for very clear distinctions between the active tab and the background tabs and in general provides for a much cleaner look.
Posted by: Anders Conbere at October 2, 2007 2:49 PM
You might like Pinstripe but it's pretty much universally hated by Mac users. I don't see much complaining here:
http://digg.com/apple/Proposed_Firefox_3_Theme_For_Mac_OS_X_Looks_Exactly_Like_Safari
The upside-down tabs have become more or less the system standard (more or less because I don't think there's an API to provide them, but given that the system tabs are unusable in this context more apps have gone with the Safari style tabs than anything and Apple is adopting it in other apps for Leopard). I appreciate that some people don't like them, but that's what 90% of the users will expect and not using them will probably lead to that same 90% bitching about it. I personally like them.
Posted by: jed at October 2, 2007 4:22 PM
Yeah, http://kmgerich.com/2006/09/27/pinstripe-for-firefox-now-with-20-more-macintosh/ with some of the later TB 2 refinements would be awsome.
Posted by: Markus at October 2, 2007 4:43 PM
People liked Pinstripe 2.0 because just about anything was better than Firefox 2's abomination of the 1.x Pinstripe ;)
Also, remember the Firefox 1.x Pinstripe theme was very Mac-like without being a slavish copy of any other Mac app. It achieved the triple of being Mac-like, distinct from other Mac apps (and easily recognizable), and it fit in the same family with Firefox's default themes on other OSes.
Finally, one major problem with Safari-style tabs is that they break the connection between the rest of the chrome and the content. Yes, all the rest of the chrome acts on that tab widget, but that tab widget is completely disconnected from the actual content it represents (and which is acted upon). It's not upside-down that's the problem--though it's odd, IMO--it's the visual disconnect (border/line of a different color at the top of the content) that comes with most upside-down tab themes.
Posted by: Smokey Ardisson at October 2, 2007 9:15 PM
Eh - all this fuss over skin. Just pay someone to make you a perfect skin and use that.
I'd like to see the mac skins work on windows. That'd be sweet (but can we have normal tabs please?)
Posted by: monk.e.boy at October 3, 2007 12:35 AM
Can we just have platform native tabs again everywhere, please? True native skins are the way to go if Firefox is intended to look vaguely mature on any given platform.
Posted by: Ben Basson at October 3, 2007 4:58 AM
I don't agree, it's a mac browser... Fitting nicely into the OS sharing similar chrome as it's native applications makes a lot of sense both from a user and a designer...
Posted by: Todd at October 3, 2007 6:51 AM
My general feedback (I've already shared this with Stephen and Kevin):
There's already a "platform integrated" browser on OS X, and that's Safari. Firefox is never going to displace that IMO in people's minds as the truest Mac browser.
So given that I feel like there's some leeway in developing UI that maintains a consistent "product identity" across different platforms.
The real shame is there'd probably be a consistent identity had Apple not changed the background colors of toolbars for Leopard to something that clashes with the icon sets of almost every third party application and leave people scurrying for these staid monochromatic looks.
I've had these discussions with several Mac users and they all mention the militant subgroup of the Mac community that insists everything look the same. I think these people are a crazy, shrinking subset of the growing Mac community but that's just me.
I should clarify: by my statements in no way do I endorse the current appearance of Firefox on the Mac. It looks terrible. I just think there's a line to be walked in the middle between looking like a weird port and Apple having melted your brain.
Posted by: Ben at October 3, 2007 10:34 AM
I've never understood people's problems with the UI on Macs. I don't own one, but whenever I've used them at friends places it looks... fine to me. The menubar is at the top. The options dialog comes down as a sheet. What exactly is people's gripe with it? Just that the buttons had color and the tabs were right side up?
Posted by: DigDug at October 3, 2007 2:04 PM
I agree that mac users, or at least mac loud-mouths, are ridiculously obsessed with the consistency of the look of their apps. But if that's what they need in order to consider using an app, and if it doesn't cause other problems, than there's no reason not to give it to them.
Personally, if I were a mac user, I'd be clamoring for the ability to resize windows from all sides and corners. But I'm more of a functionality-over-style kinda guy, so what do I know.
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