http://www.windowsvista.hu/asa/problemwithlinux.jpg

This sums up the problem with linux for me. Adobe advertising photoshop elements for windows, and other windows software on a linux application as adware. Like linux users are going see the little ad, click on it, and buy software that's not even for their operating system. Here's a clue adobe, make a linux version THEN advertise it to LINUX users, duh, duh, duh.... ok then.

Then there's firefox ads in the opera adware. I'm probably going to be forced to buy the pay version now that your blogs about linux have made me not like firefox as much anymore. I'm trying to slowly migrate to opera now, so I guess that's one more thing I won't have to worry about.

ps- sorry for the squiggly arrows. I suck at gimp.

At least I'm not the only one who has problems with a "Windows Native" theme. ;)

ant, you probably have panels on top, no window list, the metacity action_double_click_titlebar set at toggle_shade to roll up, the button_layout on metacity from left to right with the minimize and close buttons on the left side.

That's what makes this system so much better than windows. I can have it my way, and you can have it your way. I say potato, you say pototo, or however that pronounciation is spelled. Windows will never be as customizable as metacity.

"I'm probably going to be forced to buy the pay version now that your blogs about linux have made me not like firefox as much anymore. I'm trying to slowly migrate to opera now, so I guess that's one more thing I won't have to worry about." -Beer

No offense... but you sound like a guy who decided to move out neighorhood just because he didn't like the distant neighor's view on a local gas station.

That's ok, it was an empty threat anyway. Opera doesn't render alot of scriptable elements correctly, and until it does, I'll probably keep using firefox.
I'll just have to live with Asa's opinions and rely on the fact that he doesn't speak for all Mozilla developers.(hopefully)

Hehe! Funny! I also switched from Firefox (due to its snotty nature) to Opera around the same time Asa was aimlessly shooting bullets at Linux based OSes.

Jas... no offense... but it is your quiet time now.

Hi godly... well... this is that website I was telling you about. btw, get on AIM.

I'm sorry, its just amuse me that someone would switch from firefox just because a firefox developer (out of dozen or so) expressed a view about something totally unrelated to firefox. Its so irrational, it make me laugh. Hey, let move to another country since he is an American expressing view about Linux... Better yet, let move to Mars since he is an Earthing.

Anyway...

I do understand why some people take Aza's view on Linux offensive. I love Linux and I still believe Linux is the best OS around. I have several years of experence (not much compared to many experts) and I am the server adminstrator with 4 enterprise Linux servers and 1 Windows server (yuck) for a company. But I understand that Aza is not attacking linux. He is just suggesting that in order to spread Linux to regular people (computer illiterates), there need to be a very different Linux distro (dumbed-down distro).

He raised several good points because there are so many computer illiterates out there. About almost 99 percent of world population are computer illiterates. Even guys who in charge of a forum on windows tech support are computer illiterates. I have to deal with computer illiterates all day everyday. You should see me trying to explain a bash script to my boss. Everything went over his head.

Yes, Linux is elitist OS, but many Linux users strongly believe in breaking Microsoft's monopoly on OS, and yet they don't want 99 percent of world population to use it? Linux still can be elitist OS and be appealing to computer illiterates at the same time. Thats why we have distros. Elite computer users still can use distro like slackware, redhat, or any distro today (beside Linspire), but reqular people can use a dumbed-down disto, the one with Aza's suggestions of changes. Everybody will be happy here. Elites still be elites, and Microsoft's monopoly will be no more.

Would it kill him to actually start working on this OS though? That's what I don't understand? I mean, he wants it right? Why shouldn't he work on whatever he doesn't like?

Why would it be up to us small sourceforge project developers, or even Redhat or other pro devs?

Asa's got a keyboard, he has a mouse, I bet he even has a phone. Mozilla has more than enough money with google to hire some devs and do it. That's what I've said all along. I'm all for him doing whatever he wants, as long as he's not telling other people what to do, or issuing out standards from a blog pulpit.

Hey, nice to see autopackage got a mention!

Anyway, read this:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/cmp/20050811/tc_cmp/168600563

Linux on the corporate desktop is slowing. I always used to think it'd be easier to deal with the corp desktop than the end user desktop, but Firefox has little corporate penetration and ever-growing home/end user penetration so probably I was wrong. Apple of course are also making inroads on the end user desktop.

So much of what is wrong with todays Linux distributions is a matter of policy, not technology. Missing libstdc++.so.5? Policy. And policy is changed with a fork ... if there was ever a time to fork Fedora or Ubuntu and Firefoxize it, now would be the time.

Beer, there always needs to be talk about progress before progress can happen.

Asa has just been throwing ideas out to the Linux community at large. Considering that the better known Linux distros *appear* to be wanting to target Regular People, why aren't you heaping your expectations on Novell, Redhat or Ubuntu?

Instead your response is that an open source browser project and a search engine should come up a Regular People Linux distro, simply because the lead QA guy of the browser project talked about how he'd like to see Linux improve.

You need to set your expecations straight, Beer.

Oooh, Beer says that he like's Opera, and is leaving Firefox because of one of hundreds of contributors views. Oooh, I can't use this forum now, I'll have to find another one.

Can't accept my neighbours, or just anyone elses views, if I don't agree with them, and stick around, that would just be errr...democratic, open minded, constructive.

Whats that, my landord think's the new BMW car isn't as good as the last, how dare he have an opinion different to mine, right I'm packing my bags and leaving...

Anyone seeing a pattern here?

Asa, I'd love to hear the audio if you can get it. Thanks for sharing the slides - this whole discussion has actually helped me move towards getting Linux installed and start trying to learn it (even though it's not "there" for regular people yet).

Beer, it's sad to say, but I'm sorry you're still here. Well, I'm sorry you're still here, and yet still blatantly missing what's going on around you. Is this whole discussion really over your head? Or are you just so "patriotic" to Linux that you can't tolerate a single critisism of your lovely child?